SESTA/FOSTA and AdultWork.com

[Likes-Big-Girls]

Payment processors are not something I know enough about to comment, I'm afraid. Hopefully there will be alternatives to those currently in use.

[Miss Deviant]

Payment processors are not something I know enough about to comment, I'm afraid. Hopefully there will be alternatives to those currently in use.

Basically; it s a payroll service which converts monies paid from dollars to the currency of your country. It's one of the things AdultWork charge commission for. 

So to give you an idea; each week, Adultwork send instructions to their bank, to pay all the providers. The bank then sends the money to the payment processor; who converts it into the respective currency. It's then sent to each countries clearance house and then to the individual bank accounts.

The problem is when it comes to payment processors; adult services are classed as "high risk" because of possible sex-trafficking, criminal activity like money laundering - it's why the previous processor was closed down, because the payment processor was being used for money laundering. Think of it like a commercial version of Western Union; because that's essentially what it is.

Now because it's classed as "high risk", there are many payment processors who won't consider working with a client who's in the sex industry. Those who do; will probably charge exorbitant fees. We are very lucky in some respects; because the current processor may well be charging an arm and a leg, but rather than increasing the rate of commission charged; AdultWork have chosen to absorb the cost.

Now the other reason for the sudden firing of US models could be because adultwork is a .com site - which is associated with the US. Rather than risk the site being taken down to be investigated; they've chosen to get rid of the US models so that site can stay up and running.

It may be temporary; it may not. It all depends how they can prove that a) they are not US based and therefore not under FOSTA/SESTA and b) they can guarantee that sex-trafficking does not take place on their site. 

Like I said; it's a law which gives very little room for clarity in these grey areas. We all know it's less to do with combating sex-trafficking and more to do with cracking down on sex workers. The problem is; we would have to prove it.

[Likes-Big-Girls]

Ahh - excellent explanation - thanks

The devil, as usual, is in the detail. Or, as in anything to do with the current administration, lack of detail, thought, and consideration of possible consequences.

One can't, in all conscience, object to the prevention of traffiking (for whatever purpose) provided any laws are limited to, and affect only, the traffikers and help the victims of such traffiking.

Nasty situation - hopefully there'll be the required number of signatures on that petition to at least get a response.

[Miss Deviant]

Ahh - excellent explanation - thanks

The devil, as usual, is in the detail. Or, as in anything to do with the current administration, lack of detail, thought, and consideration of possible consequences.

One can't, in all conscience, object to the prevention of traffiking (for whatever purpose) provided any laws are limited to, and affect only, the traffikers and help the victims of such traffiking.

Nasty situation - hopefully there'll be the required number of signatures on that petition to at least get a response.

But you see it goes beyond that. It's basically using the "protecting the children" language to wage war on sexworkers on the internet. They use the "children" bit because it's very difficult to contest when it comes to protecting children.

It's not going to stop sex-trafficking. It's actually going to increase it. Workers will no longer be able to screen clients in the usual ways. Some will either have to lose their livelihood or forced back into street prostitution - which leaves them at risk of being trafficked. Trafficking groups are not going to advertise on somewhere like AdultWork. Yes, they may advertise on such as back page or craigslist, but not AdultWork, simply because of the rating system. 

Generally; trafficked girls are passed around the networks of trafficking groups. Why? Because your average client may be able to tell if said girl is trafficked and would alert the authorities. These girls are passed from criminals to criminals. Trafficked girls (boys, trans etc) are advertised on the dark web.  FOSTA only sends it further underground. 

You have to see the bigger picture. It's not just about sexworkers. It's taking away your rights. If you want to enjoy a steamy online session with your boo; you are now no longer allowed to do that. If you have sexy pictures of your boo stored on such as google photos; you're not allowed to.

Then there's the cloud act which was quietly pushed through. It means that any online data can be collected from US citizens by US law enforcement, from ANY country in the world. It's a snooping law.

These new laws affect every person who uses the internet. It is in effect; internet censorship. Unless those who are NOT in the sex industry see this; nothing will change. 

And notice something else - it's only because we're in the industry that we're aware of it. You won't find details of it in the mainstream news. Less people who know that they are having their rights pissed on; less people to turn around and tell those in power how they really feel about it.

[Likes-Big-Girls]

Oh I can see that there are much wider ramifications than are visible on the surface. And yes, it is very worrying. I can't see what can be done unless it's at a govenmental level, and that would need to include at the very least the entire EU (as it currently exists) and any other independant country who doesn't want their citizens spied upon.
Proof it is already happening (which it probably is) would help, but it would have to be irrefutable and come from a non-political/governmental well respected source. Those are bit thin on the ground as the Cambridge Analytica debacle has shown, and how many more of those are there out there - grabbing data and influencing the way we think? I don't know, but it's frightening.

Petitions are fine in principle, but the one you linked earlier is a US government run one (similar to the ones we have here) - anyone responding is handing them their details on a plate and just begging to be put on a "watch list". I'm not overly surprised that the 100K "signatures" hasn't yet been reached. How many sex workers (just to get back on topic-ish ) are there in the UK, EU and NA combined? More than 100K I'd wager, so why so few respondents?

Too many questions and not enough answers, as is often the case - I'll be watching this thread (and any others I find) with interest - thanks for all the info and a certain amount of eye-opening

[Miss Deviant]

Oh I can see that there are much wider ramifications than are visible on the surface. And yes, it is very worrying. I can't see what can be done unless it's at a govenmental level, and that would need to include at the very least the entire EU (as it currently exists) and any other independant country who doesn't want their citizens spied upon.
Proof it is already happening (which it probably is) would help, but it would have to be irrefutable and come from a non-political/governmental well respected source. Those are bit thin on the ground as the Cambridge Analytica debacle has shown, and how many more of those are there out there - grabbing data and influencing the way we think? I don't know, but it's frightening.

Petitions are fine in principle, but the one you linked earlier is a US government run one (similar to the ones we have here) - anyone responding is handing them their details on a plate and just begging to be put on a "watch list". I'm not overly surprised that the 100K "signatures" hasn't yet been reached. How many sex workers (just to get back on topic-ish ) are there in the UK, EU and NA combined? More than 100K I'd wager, so why so few respondents?

Too many questions and not enough answers, as is often the case - I'll be watching this thread (and any others I find) with interest - thanks for all the info and a certain amount of eye-opening

Well having just listened to @DoctorSueStorm's weekly podcast; I can tell you that the petition is absolutely pointless. Prostitution is illegal in the US and there isn't a congressman in the land who's going to stand up and say "this needs to be repealed to help the sex workers."

The answer is to play the game and be wise. If you're using clouds; back up everything and get it off the cloud. Use an encrypted email service like protonmail. Don't advertise escort services on US affiliated or based sites. Don't use vanilla platforms like paypal. If you use vanilla social media platforms like Facebook, don't post nudes. Save the nudes for switter, but make sure ALL your toots are marked as sensitive media and NSFW. DON'T post nudes on instagram. If you post nudes or porn on twitter; make sure you mark your media as sensitive; to avoid shadowbans and suspensions. 

In short; any site that children can access; don't treat it as a sexual free for all. Be responsible. The industry will continue. Right now; folks are panicking because the new law really is very obscure. But play the game, obey the rules and you'll be okay.

As much as it goes against the grain; you have to play the game and play within the rules. I hate to say it; but in essence we've had free reign of the internet for a long time and now we're being smacked down. If we toe the line; we won't get smacked down. It's possible to continue if you are wise and careful.